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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 22, 2016 20:11:24 GMT -5
OK, I excluded any averaging of cards that were minor league cards (this means no inflated staminas being brought in as well) and it brought Prince down to ~1.3. It also will have impacted some of the other guys that spent time in the minors as well. lastfirst | pos | offcomp | defcomp | stam | team | askComp | Stone, Mark | RW | 87 | 54 | 7 | OTT | 7.8 | Toffoli, Tyler | RW | 91 | 61 | 6 | LAK | 7.7 | Tarasenko, Vladimir | RW | 98 | 45 | 6 | STL | 7.4125 | Lindholm, Hampus | D | 61 | 89 | 8 | ANA | 7.1 | Huberdeau, Jonathan | LW | 89 | 40 | 6 | FLA | 6.05 | Smith, Reilly | RW/LW | 82 | 63 | 6 | FLA | 5.9 | Saad, Brandon | LW/RW | 88 | 42 | 6 | CBJ | 5.875 | Vatanen, Sami | D | 71 | 87 | 7 | ANA | 5.8 | Schwartz, Jaden | LW/C | 87 | 46 | 6 | STL | 5.725 | Gallagher, Brendan | RW | 93 | 54 | 5 | MTL | 5.425 | Ekholm, Mattias | D | 63 | 86 | 7 | NSH | 4.9 | Zibanejad, Mika | C | 82 | 45 | 6 | OTT | 4.7125 | Galchenyuk, Alex | C/LW | 90 | 39 | 5 | MTL | 4.5925 | Krug, Torey | D | 68 | 74 | 7 | BOS | 4.2 | Lovejoy, Ben | D | 47 | 95 | 6 | PIT | 4.125 | Mitchell, Willie | D | 48 | 81 | 7 | FLA | 3.8 | Coyle, Charlie | C/RW | 74 | 40 | 6 | MIN | 3.75 | Silfverberg, Jakob | RW/LW | 75 | 61 | 5 | ANA | 3.6 | Granlund, Mikael | W/C | 72 | 43 | 6 | MIN | 3.5875 | Miller, J.T. | W/C | 80 | 37 | 5 | NYR | 3.5775 | Brodin, Jonas | D | 34 | 79 | 7 | MIN | 3.455 | Marincin, Martin | D | 42 | 87 | 5 | TOR | 3.3775 | Kreider, Chris | LW | 78 | 36 | 5 | NYR | 3.37 | Nelson, Brock | C/LW | 77 | 42 | 5 | NYI | 3.325 | Hamilton, Dougie | D | 70 | 62 | 7 | CGY | 3.2 | Pirri, Brandon | W/C | 76 | 27 | 5 | ANA | 3.1025 | Pageau, Jean-Gabriel | C | 72 | 55 | 5 | OTT | 3.05 | Dumoulin, Brian | D | 52 | 80 | 6 | PIT | 2.875 | Pearson, Tanner | LW/RW | 78 | 57 | 4 | LAK | 2.75 | Schultz, Justin | D | 59 | 66 | 6 | PIT | 2.55 | Martinook, Jordan | LW/C | 64 | 61 | 5 | ARI | 2.5 | Sheahan, Riley | C/LW | 66 | 52 | 5 | DET | 2.375 | Trotman, Zach | D | 53 | 74 | 6 | BOS | 2.2875 | Namestnikov, Vladislav | C/LW | 74 | 46 | 4 | TBL | 2.2125 | Baertschi, Sven | LW | 74 | 32 | 4 | VAN | 2.11 | Roussel, Antoine | LW | 72 | 51 | 4 | DAL | 2.0625 | Zucker, Jason | LW/RW | 63 | 40 | 5 | MIN | 1.9 | Petrovic, Alex | D | 59 | 78 | 5 | FLA | 1.8875 | Hayes, Jimmy | RW/LW | 72 | 25 | 4 | BOS | 1.865 | Grigorenko, Mikhail | W/C | 71 | 37 | 4 | COL | 1.8475 | Yakupov, Nail | RW/LW | 70 | 31 | 4 | EDM | 1.8025 | Girgensons, Zemgus | W/C | 61 | 44 | 5 | BUF | 1.75 | Beaulieu, Nathan | D | 60 | 62 | 6 | MTL | 1.675 | Connauton, Kevin | D | 60 | 74 | 5 | ARI | 1.65 | Brown, J.T. | LW/RW | 64 | 55 | 4 | TBL | 1.6125 | Larsson, Johan | C/W | 60 | 38 | 5 | BUF | 1.585 | Pateryn, Greg | D | 54 | 70 | 5 | MTL | 1.5125 | Flynn, Brian | W/C | 58 | 50 | 3 | MTL | 1.4375 | Bennett, Beau | RW/LW | 74 | 26 | 3 | PIT | 1.4 | Pysyk, Mark | D | 53 | 65 | 5 | BUF | 1.4 | Farnham, Bobby | LW/RW | 65 | 25 | 3 | NJD | 1.39 | Strait, Brian | D | 40 | 69 | 5 | NYI | 1.39 | Etem, Emerson | LW/RW | 63 | 30 | 4 | VAN | 1.3775 | Bartley, Victor | D | 32 | 70 | 4 | MTL | 1.3625 | Nemeth, Patrik | D | 57 | 61 | 5 | DAL | 1.3625 | Morrow, Joe | D | 56 | 62 | 5 | BOS | 1.3625 | Chiasson, Alex | RW | 58 | 43 | 4 | OTT | 1.36 | Randell, Tyler | RW | 80 | 32 | 2 | BOS | 1.34 | Wilson, Scott | LW | 69 | 29 | 3 | PIT | 1.3225 | Clune, Rich | LW/RW | 68 | 33 | 3 | TOR | 1.32 | Prince, Shane | LW/C | 68 | 32 | 3 | NYI | 1.3125 | Clendening, Adam | D | 59 | 48 | 5 | EDM | 1.2725 | McIlrath, Dylan | D | 49 | 69 | 4 | NYR | 1.255 | Shore, Drew | C/RW | 52 | 50 | 3 | CGY | 1.2125 | Andreoff, Andy | C/LW | 63 | 28 | 3 | LAK | 1.19 | Howden, Quinton | LW/RW | 62 | 27 | 3 | FLA | 1.17 | Bitetto, Anthony | D | 61 | 47 | 4 | NSH | 1.165 | Jurco, Tomas | RW/LW | 60 | 27 | 3 | DET | 1.1575 | Kostka, Michael | D | 36 | 54 | 5 | OTT | 1.1475 | Oleksiak, Jamie | D | 46 | 56 | 4 | DAL | 1.1325 | Mashinter, Brandon | LW | 61 | 20 | 2 | CHI | 1.12 | Chaput, Michael | C/LW | 39 | 43 | 3 | CBJ | 1.0875 | Agozzino, Andrew | C/LW | 51 | 32 | 3 | COL | 1.0875 | Postma, Paul | D | 44 | 48 | 3 | WPG | 1.0725 | Tennyson, Matt | D | 56 | 35 | 3 | SJS | 1.0725 | Klinkhammer, Rob | LW/RW | 47 | 30 | 3 | EDM | 1.0575 | Ellis, Morgan | D | 36 | 49 | 9 | St. John's IceCaps | 1.0425 | Grant, Derek | C/LW | 38 | 46 | 4 | Stockton Heat | 1.035 | Tinordi, Jarred | D | 19 | 61 | 4 | ARI | 1.0225 | Sutter, Brody | RW/C | 34 | 37 | 3 | CAR | 1.02 | Leduc, Jerome | D | 34 | 48 | 9 | Binghamton Senators | 1.02 | Szwarz, Jordan | RW | 37 | 44 | 6 | Springfield Falcons | 1.0125 | Jensen, Nicklas | RW/LW | 40 | 36 | 8 | Hartford Wolf Pack | 0.9975 | Fedun, Taylor | D | 34 | 56 | 3 | VAN | 0.9975 | Brown, Chris | C/RW | 47 | 21 | 2 | WSH | 0.9975 | Mouillierat, Kael | C/LW | 38 | 28 | 3 | PIT | 0.99 | Phillips, Zack | C | 33 | 42 | 5 | Chicago Wolves | 0.99 | Gormley, Brandon | D | 35 | 39 | 4 | San Antonio Rampage | 0.9825 | Halmo, Mike | RW | 40 | 33 | 9 | Bridgeport Sound Tigers | 0.9825 | Thomas, Christian | RW | 42 | 30 | 3 | Springfield Falcons | 0.975 | Whitney, Joe | LW | 36 | 34 | 4 | Bridgeport Sound Tigers | 0.96 | Hamilton, Freddie | C/RW | 37 | 32 | 7 | Stockton Heat | 0.9525 | Hrivik, Marek | LW/RW | 41 | 27 | 8 | Hartford Wolf Pack | 0.945 | Matteau, Stefan | LW/RW | 38 | 21 | 3 | MTL | 0.945 | Reinhart, Maxwell | C/LW | 39 | 27 | 9 | Milwaukee Admirals | 0.9375 | Gragnani, Marc-Andre | D | 35 | 30 | 4 | NJD | 0.9375 | Florek, Justin | LW | 31 | 35 | 9 | Bridgeport Sound Tigers | 0.9375 | Comrie, Adam | D | 32 | 32 | 3 | Lehigh Valley Phantoms | 0.93 | Bulmer, Brett | RW/LW | 31 | 33 | 7 | Iowa Wild | 0.93 | Beach, Cody | RW | 32 | 32 | 2 | Chicago Wolves | 0.93 | Lashoff, Brian | D | 31 | 30 | 9 | Grand Rapids Griffins | 0.915 | Welsh, Jeremy | C/LW | 30 | 29 | 9 | Chicago Wolves | 0.9075 | Cross, Tommy | D | 30 | 28 | 7 | Providence Bruins | 0.9 | McFarland, John | LW/RW | 33 | 23 | 6 | Portland Pirates | 0.8925 | Bournival, Michael | LW/RW | 28 | 28 | 1 | St. John's IceCaps | 0.885 | Sgarbossa, Michael | C | 31 | 25 | 7 | San Diego Gulls | 0.885 | Heard, Mitchell | C | 28 | 28 | 2 | Stockton Heat | 0.885 | Payerl, Adam | RW | 36 | 18 | 9 | Milwaukee Admirals | 0.8775 | Gernat, Martin | D | 22 | 32 | 2 | San Diego Gulls | 0.8775 | Bellemore, Brett | D | 22 | 32 | 6 | Providence Bruins | 0.8775 | Black, Graham | C | 31 | 18 | 5 | Albany Devils | 0.8475 | Smith, Dalton | LW | 17 | 32 | 2 | Lehigh Valley Phantoms | 0.8475 | Sauve, Yann | D | 20 | 20 | 1 | Stockton Heat | 0.81 | Wrenn, William | D | 14 | 20 | 1 | Utica Comets | 0.7725 | Beaupre, Gabriel | D | 14 | 20 | 1 | San Antonio Rampage | 0.7725 |
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Post by Chris-Suffolk on Jul 22, 2016 20:31:27 GMT -5
The problem I see, is when we have guys coming off their ELC deals, OUR concept is that the players "asking price" is derived from what his CURRENT NHL status is, and how well he did. But in the GHL, our GM's have not had the opportunity for that player to perform to those standards yet, or during his ELC term. I just dont agree that we should have to pay AHEAD of the players actual performance. Thats just not realistic in my opinion. Obviously, in the NHL players, their agent and the GM's discuss new contracts. A Hampus Lindholm would not request a 7.1 contract per season even after the NHL season he just played. The only league that would pay that money, is the KHL. That 7.1 is more like a Free Agency period offer. That's my opinion, and I strongly feel that way. I dont think you can find many ELC's that went from their ELC deal to a 7.1 contract, or even asked that much. If you do find one, it will most likely be a NHL League Leader in multiple categories. I think Ian might be on to something. I'll take it a step further. Possibly, take that RFA's last three years of Cards, get an Avg for Off/Def. This would become the GM's side, or Arbitration Delivery. Then take the Formula you use to generate a players "Asking Price". From there, maybe we can find a common ground to determine a "Players Worth" and get a contract done.
This would seem more like a real Arbitration hearing, or discussion between two sides. The Players Side and the GM/Organizational side. How does that sound? BTW...I meant for this to be RFA I's...not all RFA's. This is a good idea, I think, I hope, for Bridge Contracts. No.
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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 23, 2016 6:18:58 GMT -5
I see this process as similar to buying a car. When you walk into a dealership and they have a car with a retail price of $33k. You go in and offer 27.5K, they say "let me take that to my manager" and he comes back with a slightly lower price. After about 2 hours of negotiating you both settle on $30k.
As we don't have real players agents to extol the players virtues, while minimizing the negatives, we can go about it two ways. I could come up with the asking price and add 10% to it and the GM can start with the asking price and decrease 10% from it or we can just start with what the final choice will be.
Much like buying a car, I think starting with the final price makes much more sense.
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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 23, 2016 7:35:05 GMT -5
Goalies: lastfirst | pos | techpts | athlpts | stam | team | askComp | Mrazek, Petr | G | 72 | 75 | 8 | DET | 5.1 | Andersen, Frederik | G | 74 | 72 | 7 | ANA | 3.6 | Pickard, Calvin | G | 68 | 76 | 7 | COL | 3.4 | Darling, Scott | G | 62 | 68 | 5 | CHI | 1.6 | Grubauer, Philipp | G | 73 | 71 | 4 | WSH | 1.55 | Hammond, Andrew | G | 60 | 66 | 5 | OTT | 1.5375 | Hellberg, Magnus | G | 49 | 50 | 8 | Hartford Wolf Pack | 1.0425 | Visentin, Mark | G | 43 | 40 | 3 | Rockford IceHogs | 0.96 |
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Post by Phil-Cornwall on Jul 23, 2016 7:42:31 GMT -5
I guess Chris and I get punished for speaking out...thanks.
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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 23, 2016 7:53:08 GMT -5
Maybe you can illuminate the less educated here (like myself) as to how you are getting punished exactly?
*EDIT* for reference and context:
punish verb pun·ish \ˈpə-nish\
Simple Definition of punish
: to make (someone) suffer for a crime or for bad behavior
: to make someone suffer for (a crime or bad behavior)
: to treat (someone or something) severely or roughly
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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 23, 2016 9:41:32 GMT -5
Asking prices has been retrofitted onto the team pages.
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Post by Matt-Colorado on Jul 23, 2016 9:42:54 GMT -5
Asking prices has been retrofitted onto the team pages. Fantastic.
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Post by Chris-Suffolk on Jul 23, 2016 10:00:34 GMT -5
One last question before I shrivel up like a raisin. I'm just trying to get an understanding on the derivation of the asking price. What is the numerical/monetary difference in each level of Stamina? For ex: comparing Hampy Lindholm to Sami Vatanen Is it 1.3 million for each level? Vatanen has a better Offense Rating and same Defense Rating, is asking 5.8 to Hampy's 7.1. So, that's what I am understanding....Stamina = More Value than Statistic Performance
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Post by Brian-Cleveland on Jul 23, 2016 10:08:54 GMT -5
We've talked about stamina. How much is fortitude impacting asking prices?
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Post by Chris-Suffolk on Jul 23, 2016 10:13:55 GMT -5
We've talked about stamina. How much is fortitude impacting asking prices? Please point me in that direction. I've been away from the league, a few things have changed. Just trying to get a proper understanding is all. Not trying to stir it up, but everyone keeps taking my posts as a shit stirrer and not answering. FFS! <<<<<< ( Copyright Infringemanet ) Sorry Phil.
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Post by Chris-Suffolk on Jul 23, 2016 10:15:19 GMT -5
DO you guys realize just how much there is to read on the forum to catch up. Not just for a NEW guy, but for someone who has been away.....Owen and Myself.
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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 23, 2016 10:44:22 GMT -5
One last question before I shrivel up like a raisin. I'm just trying to get an understanding on the derivation of the asking price. What is the numerical/monetary difference in each level of Stamina? For ex: comparing Hampy Lindholm to Sami Vatanen Is it 1.3 million for each level? Vatanen has a better Offense Rating and same Defense Rating, is asking 5.8 to Hampy's 7.1. So, that's what I am understanding....Stamina = More Value than Statistic Performance I posted this prior somewhere but stamina is factored in thusly: D (stam/10) + .3 F (stam/10) + .5 This factor is then applied to the Off and Def scores to arrive at a composite score. This composite score is then looked up on a table to determine asking price. This being the case here are the players factors: Lindhom's is 1.1 (8/10)+.3 Vatanen is a 1.0 (7/10)+.3 If we add Vatanen scores we get a base of 158. 1.0 is applied to this so his final score is 158 If we add Lindholms scores we get a base of 150. 1.1 is applied to that and his final score is 165 (150*1.1)
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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 23, 2016 10:45:50 GMT -5
We've talked about stamina. How much is fortitude impacting asking prices? Fortitude does not factor in because OFF/DEF values are already nerfed for guys that don't play a significant number of games.
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Post by Glenn-Philadelphia on Jul 23, 2016 10:47:11 GMT -5
We've talked about stamina. How much is fortitude impacting asking prices? Please point me in that direction. I've been away from the league, a few things have changed. Just trying to get a proper understanding is all. Not trying to stir it up, but everyone keeps taking my posts as a shit stirrer and not answering. FFS! <<<<<< ( Copyright Infringemanet ) Sorry Phil.
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